Not exactly the forgotten man, Robbie Deans could so easily be in and around Auckland this weekend. The sliding doors of fate connived otherwise. Instead, he's living three hours north of Tokyo, deep into the Japanese countryside.
“I got appointed by Canterbury (in 1997) and brought Steve (Hansen) on as the backs coach and he became the forwards coach!” Deans remembers, in an interview with The Irish Times from the Panasonic White Knights base where he’s been head coach since 2014.
“So, Steve was always a capable coach. We worked well together.”
Sliding doors barely covers it. Deans became assistant coach of the All Blacks under John Mitchell from 2001-03 before returning to the Crusaders, where he won five Super Rugby titles, making him the most successful coach in the competition's history. Hansen went the other way, latching onto Graham Henry's wagon, replacing him as Wales coach in 2002, before assisting Sir Ted all the way from 2004 to 2011 when he, again, succeeded him as All Blacks supremo.
A job that Deans seemed nailed on to get after that unbelievable night in Cardiff in 2007.
Nobody could have foreseen Henry remaining as All Blacks coach after Thierry Dusautoir, Freddie Michalak and Wayne Barnes conspired to help France beat New Zealand in that World Cup quarter-final.
That's where rugby is still young as a code. The discard mentality. You drop one, 'Aw you're gone!'
Throughout the history of New Zealand rugby, seconds are hard to find.
Until this moment.
“But that was a point of growth (for the All Blacks),” he said of Henry’s reappointment as Deans, within a few months, and in a weird kink of fate, went on to coach Australia against New Zealand. “That’s where rugby is still young as a code. The discard mentality. You drop one, ‘Aw you’re gone!’ When in actual fact losing is part of your learning. You only have to look at American Football - they’ve got 78-year-old coaches! So long as you keep learning you are better for it.”
On that premise, Deans is still only 57 (Hansen is 58 and Warren Gatland a baby at 53), so does he see the All Blacks job coming back around?
“No, no. Very unlikely. Doesn’t worry me. I’ve been lucky. Who knows what’s around the corner? I gave up second guessing it years ago. At the time, the missed appointment (in 2008), you go into that process seeking to know what they are thinking. They got it right; they won the next World Cup. That was the whole point of it.
“You get your answer and you keep moving. It is no different for a player. A player is in or out of the 15, 23 or 30 but you don’t expect them to lie down. They keep going. Just paddle on.”
The 2011 Rugby World Cup almost went horribly wrong for Deans and the Wallabies - losing in the pool stages to Ireland at Eden Park - but they typically recovered to force one of the greatest Richie McCaw performances to guide New Zealand into the final.
Knowing the men, both are functioning typically
Deans stayed at the helm as a disjointed, rag-tag in player terms, Wallabies dragged the Lions into a series decider in 2013.
Every Kiwi over 50 must be giggling with delight when they see Hansen and Gatland publicly sparring. Deans is no different.
“Knowing the men, both are functioning typically,” he laughs. “They are both quite laconic and they both would much prefer to give then receive. Where it goes . . .”
Has it gone too far?
“No, I don’t think so. Yet.”
All told, it leaves him well to speak about the current upcoming series.
“I think the Lions would be privately quite happy where they are at. Both camps will enter with high expectations. It is going to be a great series.
“What the Lions are doing is very much a Saracens approach, to put a brand on it, and Saracens don’t get tipped over very often. It is going to be a good contest and there are some very capable players. The viewing public tend to get carried away with the flashy stuff but attack starts with defence.”
The All Blacks ferocious, violent response after losing in Dublin is mentioned. That’s what we are going to get from kick-off?
“Yeah, I agree. It is going to be a great series.”
* Robbie Deans speaks exclusively to The Irish Times in Saturday’s newspaper about Japan’s ability to host the 2019 World Cup and difficulties with leaving a lasting legacy.
