Mahon tribunal:Bank records do not support a statement by the Taoiseach, Bertie Ahern, that he believed he bought stg£30,000 at AIB O'Connell Street, Dublin, in the first half of 1995, the tribunal heard.
The tribunal heard that Mr Ahern has said, in the course of a private interview with the tribunal, that sterling cash lodgments of £10,000 and £20,000 he made in the second half of 1995, were the relodgment of money he withdrew earlier that year, converted into sterling, and then relodged.
Henry Murphy SC, for the tribunal, read out to bank official Philip Murphy a letter from AIB's solicitor in which the solicitor said investigations carried out by the bank had not been able to identify a sale of £30,000 during the period in question. The period covered by the bank's inquiries, which are ongoing, was a few days short of the period in which the sale could have been made.
The tribunal heard that the largest amount of sterling sold by the branch during the period had a value of Ir£9,451.50, and that the average value for the sales during the period was £2,133.65.
Responding to counsel the witness agreed that if the bank records were correct then the transaction did not occur as far as the bank was concerned.
Conor Maguire SC, for Mr Ahern, said that Mr Ahern in his interview had not been categoric that he had bought the sterling in AIB O'Connell St.
He said that Mr Murphy should not put questions to the witness with such a basis.
Extracts from Mr Ahern's private interview with the tribunal were read out in which he said the money was withdrawn from the bank, and converted into sterling as he intended giving it to Michael Wall, a businessman based in Manchester.
In the event, Mr Ahern said, he didn't and the money was relodged.
The witness, Mr Murphy, said he was assistant manager at AIB O'Connell St in the early 1990s and dealt with Mr Ahern. Such a large amount of sterling most likely would have had to be ordered.
He imagined he would have dealt with such a matter for Mr Ahern, but he had no memory of it.
When Mr Murphy asked the witness if he believed Mr Ahern, Mr Maguire objected and the chairman, Judge Mahon, agreed that it was not a correct question.
"I have no recollection of that," the witness said. "I don't know whether it did happen or didn't happen . . . If Mr Ahern said it did happen, maybe it did happen."
He said he had no reason to doubt Mr Ahern. "I am just saying I've no recollection."
Counsel said that given that Mr Ahern was at the time the minister for finance, it was not credible that Mr Murphy would not recall the transaction if he had been involved.
Mr Murphy said he had no recollection of it.
Mr Murphy was asked about the lodgment of stg£20,000 on December 1st, 1995. An entry in Mr Ahern's diary for November 30th read: "5pm. Philip Murphy. St Lukes."
Mr Murphy said he might have met Mr Ahern that evening, collected the sterling, and lodged it the following day. However, he could not recall doing so.
Mr Murphy was also asked about the lodgment of £24,838.49 on October 11th, 1994. Counsel said Mr Ahern had told the tribunal that this was made up of £16,500 and £8,000. Mr Maguire said Mr Ahern had said it was £8,000 "or thereabouts".
The chairman said Mr Ahern had qualified his statement regarding the amount, to which counsel for the tribunal replied: "Mr Ahern doesn't say anything without qualification."
Mr Murphy put it to the witness that given the rates for sterling on the day, the amount lodged did not equate to Ir£16,500 and stg£8,000. The tribunal adjourned and Mr Murphy is to continue his evidence next Tuesday.
